Listen to this, Eddie, a conversation held between Oren Ambarchi and Marco Fusinato, was recorded during a soundcheck at Melbourne venue The Toff in Town.
The conversation was first recorded for publication in 21: 100: 100, One Hundred Sound Works by One Hundred Artists from the 21st Century, a book accompanying the exhibition of the same title, curated by Alexie Glass-Kantor, Emily Cormack, Marco Fusinato and Oren Ambarchi, and exhibited at Gertrude Contemporary, 200 Gertrude Street, Fitzroy, from 11 October – 8 November as part of the 2008 Melbourne International Arts Festival.
At the time, international renowned Australian artists Fusinato and Ambarchi both programmed gigs at The Toff – Ambarchi curated the ‘Maximum Arousel’ series, and Fusinato curated ‘YOU DON’T HAVE TO CALL IT MUSIC: music by visual artists’.
‘…’ in the text denotes a pause in the conversation. The ‘------------’ denotes the recording was paused due to excessive volume in the room during the soundcheck.
OA_ Nah nah I don’t like him… he’s dodgy.
MF_ See that should’ve been…
OA_ Yeahhhh, you go on about it…
MF_ Alright
OA_ forever.
MF_ Yeah yeah…
OA_ When I talked to hi about it, he was like, ‘Nnnyeah…’ he wasn’t even excited… shmuck!
MF_ Really? Mona!
OA_ Yeah, like… ‘I deserve to be in it.’
MF_ Want me to…
OA_ Keen it on, keep it on… KEEP IT ON!
MF_ OK, it’s on!
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MF_ I don't recall ever having a conversation, talking to you about sound art.
OA_ I didn't realise it had anything to do with sound art 'til much later! We just thought, let's get people that we find... interesting, important, y'know...
MF_ ...that are extending the language and parameters of what sound or music can be…
OA_ Well that's what's always interested me… y'know if they're an instrumentalist and they extend the language of the particular instrument… or of the genre they're in... but more importantly leave their personal stamp on the work.
MF_ What about how we're bringing together such diverse genres of what most purists wouldn't consider worthy of serious consideration under this theme… yet we're presenting them here as a major influence on an array of artists working today... well it's certainly been influential to me.
OA_ Well I think we're supporters of this stuff. We're directly involved, performing, putting on shows… we're collectors, avid listeners… we go to the shows… I'm not really thinking about 'what it is' or the 'labels', where it 'sits'. I'm passionate about it, I'm into it.
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OA_ Let's explain how this came about.
MF_ Well we were approached by Alexie at Gertrude Contemporary Art Spaces to be involved in this project... she already had the title and the overall concept worked out... 100 sound pieces by 100 artists from the 21st century... 100 sets of headphones suspended from the ceiling throughout the gallery space with an individual piece in each set. There's also a bio and text relating to each piece on the floor which the headphones rest on. So we came in to...
OA_ ...advise, recommend the artists. I mean we have a personal connection to a lot of them...
MF_ It'd be good to talk about some of the artists in the show, obviously not all but just some to give an indication of what's going on... Because the show's based here there's a focus on stuff that's going on here... Another thing I've realised is that when there's a group included, the members are also doing interesting things in their individual practice but we've included the group in order to maximise the numbers...
OA_ Unfortunately there's only so many people you can include, y'know... it's quite limited; for example Pateras/Baxter/Brown trio, all of them are very important artists based in Melbourne... Pateras has a wide range of things that he does including classical composition, solo prepared piano, electronic stuff... same with Baxter and Brown... unfortunately we couldn't include all that but hopefully when the audience reads about P/B/B and listens to the piece they'll investigate the individuals in the trio...
MF_ That's what we're hoping. SSL is another example of this…
OA_ Yeah that's Robbie Avenaim and Dale Gorfinkel. It's a really innovative duo of extended vibraphone playing. Amazing... It ain't no Bobby Hutcherson record (laughter). I don't know anybody else doing anything like it, but both of those guys have so many different projects... from gallery installations through to punk/improv/jazz gigs… again how can you represent all that activity here?
MF_ Yeah, right there's a lot of examples like that...
OA_ I think that's the nature of a lot of the artists involved in this show - for example artists like Otomo and 0'Rourke have so many facets to their practice, it's really difficult to convey the breadth of their output with just one audio work.
MF_ I also like how it's cross-generational, for example Frances Plagne, who's just into his 20s, making pieces from an amalgam of experimental music tendencies fused with pure pop sensibilities...
OA_ He's a really forward-thinking pop composer influenced by people like Van Dyke Parks and legendary pop records but has his own personal take on it, which is also highly experimental and involves lo-fi electronics, musique-concrete, cut ups.. all these things come into play within the structure of a pop song. Then you have people like Charlemagne Palestine, Alvin Lucier, Gordon Mumma, and a lot of older composers...
OA_ …who are still really vital and doing important things - Hermann Nitsch, Ghédalia Tazartès - who are influential on a generation of younger artists. Their projects are always evolving.
OA_ In a way similar to what we were talking about with Alvin Lucier and the others, the Incapacitants are the old guard of the Japanese Noise scene, who have been at it for years and they're still going whether people like it or not (laughter).
MF_ That's a common thread throughout this selection isn't it... persistence... irrespective of fashion. There's pockets of this activity going on all over... Y'know, certain genres continue to exist, evolve and mutate.
OA_ And once in a while it's in vogue and then it's forgotten... but it's always happening in the underground.
MF_ There are some major figures included, for example, Sonic Youth, Scott Walker, Christian Marclay…
OA_ Yeah right, and then there's someone like the Sun City Girls, those guys have been doing stuff since the '80s... they've made a thousand different records that are incredibly diverse… What do you choose?
MF_ Well, we're just providing a taster. And although some of these artists have been practising for decades, this show is about works from this century. And it's a testament to their practice that their work is still engaging and important now. And we hope that the audience will further investigate if they like what they hear...
OA_ An interesting part of the process has been how specific the artists have been about the piece they're submitting... or not. Some are easy going, happy to have a track lifted from an existing recording, while others are composing a piece specifically for this context and it's interesting to see how each artist engages with their work being presented on headphones.
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MF_ Yeah I reckon that's why someone like Jandek or Striborg are important in this context 'cos they're two examples of what traditionally might be referred to as outsider artists but I see them as good examples of artists who have a clear vision... What they put out into the world is clearly considered, very specific, unique and true to them. from their own personal soundworld down to the package design and the image that they're portraying and the way they want the information disseminated.
OA_ It's beautiful, someone like Jandek or Striborg... there's no difference between them and an important figurehead like Sun Ra, creating, from seemingly nothing, their own universe.
MF_ Yeah right... industries. They're totally aware of their image, mythology... worldview.
OA_ The great thing about Striborg is that it's someone who's just doing it without regard for the whole institutional framework. He's just...
MF_ I don't think he'd give a shit (laughter).
OA_ ...which makes it more special in a way. It's like a research project that goes for their whole life... it's a serious endeavour. I mean like Keith Rowe... there's a connection between him and Striborg or Jandek... people who have just been continually exploring the same pursuit throughout their lives and refining it. I love that.
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MF_ Let's talk generally about some of these small, disparate scenes happening throughout Australia.
OA_ Well, there are all these pockets; they're all self-made scenes that are happening in these weird rural areas.
MF_ But you could say that about Melbourne too... it has a very particular scene and situation happening. A definitive scene.
OA: It's a strong community in Melbourne for sure, but at the same time there are all these smaller towns around Australia with these communities of artists doing stuff. For example, the Brothers of the Occult Sisterhood are from the border of New South Wales and Queensland and they've released loads of CD-Rs of so many different projects and offshoots... people know more about them internationally than they do here. And then there's the Blue Mountain scene and that's been going for a few years now... so there's a little bit of that in the show too.
MF_ That ties in with the whole CD-R boom in the last few years. Which is an international phenomena right, a bit like the cassette scene from the '80s. Actually, when you think of it, when you experience this show in the gallery, it's like being inside a massive mixtape.
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MF_ What about Rod Cooper... He's a guy who makes and plays his own instruments. They are usually made from steel and sometimes include electronics, which he scrapes, bangs and scratches to get sounds from and they sound incredibly rich in detail. They're mad, organic sculptures.
OA_ Brendan Walls also makes stuff... motors, constructions, very different to Rod Cooper though, more going into the sound phenomena area, like Alvin Lucier meets a mechanic (laughter).
MF_ There's Robin Fox's synesthesia overload, where he triggers sound and laser from his computer with incredible control... it's a real trip to experience one of his performances... to be engulfed in light and a maelstrom of sound.
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OA_ We've got a few people who do the field recording thing (laughter) over the past few years it seems everyone's a 'field recording artist'; all of a sudden (more laughter), like laptop music before that. But we've got the people who have been doing it seriously for years and have defined the genre.
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OA_ Some of the visual artists using sound I'm not familiar with. Owada for example, since you're in that world maybe you can talk a bit about that?
MF_ Well, as you know there's a long history of visual artists using sound or music in their work... there's a small selection in this show but it does demonstrate many ways of approaching it... Someone like Stephen Prina, who has a very tight and considered way of working across all media. Eugene Carchesio, who's been making music for as long as he's been exhibiting... has a very simple, improvised lo-fi aesthetic. Then there's The Donkey's Tail, John Nixon's project, which has a continually shifting line-up... it's a kind of a junk, free folk, rock ensemble...
OA_ Yeah, from what I've experienced it's quite punk rock... like the Nihilist Spasm Band of Melbourne, cos yeah, you've got that series of music by visual artists and a lot of these people have played right?
MF_ Yeah, Snawklor... Paeces, who are made up of visual artists. They do gallery-based exhibitions but also have multiple sound projects on the go. Oh yeah, that's what I was gonna say, Owada is Martin Creed's band... it's reductive, song-based rock, kinda like the Ramones meets Sesame Street. For example, on some songs the lyrics are made of just counting... 1, 2, 3, 4... or just with one phrase repeated, like 'fuck off'. I think the interesting thing about these artists is that what they do in their sound practice relates clearly to what they are doing in their visual arts practice. There are certain ideas... concerns that they're pursuing irrespective of medium... it's all encompassing...
OA_ You know what I like, the way there's something strong, considered, about all the people in the show, very individual takes, and that's what connects them.
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OA_ Care for another beverage? Where were we?
MF_ Y'know this is bullshit talking about this stuff, the real way to experience it is by listening.
OA_ I hate it when artists have to explain what they're doing! So are we meant to be justifying what sound art is?!... 'Cos I couldn't give a shit, I really couldn't, we're just presenting stuff that's going on now... and it's just a touch of what's going on now. A little sample... and these people are just doing it. not for the money, they're just doing it... which makes it more interesting in my opinion... so it might be really naïve but I'm not looking at it as 'is this sound art?', 'is this not sound art?' Others can work that out!
MF_ We didn't approach it from an academic viewpoint.
OA_ Nah man... we're involved with this stuff. We live this stuff, we breathe it, we don't think about 'categories', it's more like... Does the idea excite you? Does it move you? Does it make you think? That's what it boils down to! Maybe I'm too emotional about this?
MF_ No, no, that's valid.
OA_ Maybe we're silly to do it that way.
MF_Well, it's probably 'uncuratorial'
OA_ Well, maybe it is. Regardless, it's amazing all the killer artists that are a part of this show... I mean for crying out loud look at the list! (laughter).
